Dev Chat Summary, December 10th

https://wordpress.slack.com/archives/core/p1418245350000526

https://make.wordpress.org/core/2014/12/10/release-candidate-and-todays-dev-meeting-agenda/

Misses

  • RC

Decisions

  • About page text will land tonight (Wednesday the 10th).
  • Moving APIAPI An API or Application Programming Interface is a software intermediary that allows programs to interact with each other and share data in limited, clearly defined ways. docs into the pluginPlugin A plugin is a piece of software containing a group of functions that can be added to a WordPress website. They can extend functionality or add new features to your WordPress websites. WordPress plugins are written in the PHP programming language and integrate seamlessly with WordPress. These can be free in the WordPress.org Plugin Directory https://wordpress.org/plugins/ or can be cost-based plugin from a third-party and theme handbooks will be discussed at the next docs meeting.
  • A heads up email to plugin devs will go out after RC.
  • RC will go out tonight.
  • @nacin will alert hosts and one-click installers in advance release.
  • 4.1 final targeted for Tuesday.
  • Release dry-run on Monday.
  • Status check-in meeting on Sunday.

Assignments

  • @stephdau and @nacin will enable localized results for plugins after RC.
  • @nacin will work on the plugin developer email.
  • @melchoyce @ryelle @helen @jorbin will work on the about page. First draft design due by Friday.
  • @nacin @markjaquith will make the final decision on Focus, Distraction Free Writing naming, branding, text.
  • @nacin will alert hosts and one-click installers in advance of release.

Links Mentioned

https://wordpress.org/support/forum/alphabeta
https://core.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/30337
https://wordpress.org/about/roadmap/
https://core.trac.wordpress.org/query?status=!closed&version=trunk&order=modified
https://core.trac.wordpress.org/query?status=!closed&version=trunk&order=modified&milestone=Awaiting+Review&group=type

Plugin I18ni18n Internationalization, or the act of writing and preparing code to be fully translatable into other languages. Also see localization. Often written with a lowercase i so it is not confused with a lowercase L or the numeral 1. Often an acquired skill.

johnbillion [15:08]
Status updates: @stephdau has been working on the plugin directory internationalisation

johnbillion [15:09]
See his comment on the agenda blogblog (versus network, site) post if you want more info

johnbillion [15:09]
tl;dr while we’re not going to have many translations, the infrastructure is there

nacin [15:10]
there’s a lot of languages and a lot of plugins and themes, which means it’ll require a while for things to be well-populated before it makes sense to turn on the switches.

stephdau [15:10]
4.1: make it possible. 4.2: make it translated :simple_smile:

petya [15:10]
that’s optimistic :simple_smile:

nacin [15:10]
stephdau: I’d love to turn it on before 4.2 :simple_smile:

nacin [15:10]
only thing worse than something 0% translated is for something to be obnoxiously 1-5% translated.

nacin [15:11]
it’s like finding the half of a worm in your apple.

johnbillion [15:12]
@nacin what do we need in coreCore Core is the set of software required to run WordPress. The Core Development Team builds WordPress. to enable localised results?

nacin [15:12]
A few lines of code. @stephdau and I will look at it after RC.

johnbillion [15:12]
Righto

Recommended Plugins

johnbillion [15:13]
On a similar note, we now have the Recommended tab in the plugin installer which shows recommendations thanks to @tellyworth‘s work on the API side of that

nacin [15:13]
Hm. We should add that to the about page.

johnbillion [15:13]
Improvements to that are all on the API side, as will the plugin localisation work

stephdau [15:14]
enable: yup, just passing a language string to the api

nacin [15:15]
yeah, we do that now, but there needs to be a way for someone to override that in the UIUI User interface and request all results, and to toggle back

nacin [15:15]
it’s not complicated, though

johnbillion [15:15]
Checkbox?

nacin [15:15]
link at the bottom of search results, or a checkbox could work too

nacin [15:15]
I came up with strings for it

nacin [15:15]
regardless, I’d look right past this and keep going, we can regroup tomorrow

ocean90 [15:17]
@johnbillion: Is this tab working currently? I’m getting the same results as on the Featured tab.

johnbillion [15:18]
@ocean90 it depends on your currently installed plugins, see 30337

johnbillion [15:18]
It falls back to featured plugins AFAIK

tellyworth [15:19]
You’ll get the same results as Popular if you have no plugins installed.

ocean90 [15:19]
Then we should hide the tab.

tellyworth [15:19]
If there are plugins installed but no specific results, try forcing a check for plugin updates first, see if that makes the difference.

ocean90 [15:19]
(But currently I have plugins installed.)

tellyworth [15:20]
I’ll probably have it fall back to something other than duplicating Popular once I’ve fixed other issues. That’s all api side.

nacin [15:20]
it’s possible we should say “You don’t have enough plugins installed for us to make a good recommendation.” if you don’t have any plugins installed, only have Akismet or Hello Dolly installed, or if you have so few installed that our confidence level is low.

nacin [15:20]
thoughts?

“You don’t have enough plugins installed yet for us to make a good recommendation.”

tellyworth [15:21]
ocean90, if forcing an update check doesn’t help, can you post steps to the ticketticket Created for both bug reports and feature development on the bug tracker. please? 30337.

jeffr0 [15:21]
I tested the tab earlier today and saw a list of Recommended plugins. I have 28 installed

johnbillion [15:21]
This is why it was originally suggested to replace the Popular tab

richardtape [15:21]
If we don’t have recommendations to make, should we show the tab at all?

ocean90 [15:21]
tellyworth: Will let you know, yes.

tellyworth [15:21]
It can always recommend something. There’s no reason for the results to be empty.

johnbillion [15:21]
Recommended doesn’t necessarily mean personalised

davidlaietta [15:21]
Couldn’t popular be consider recommendations in that case @richardtape

richardtape [15:22]
that was my thought too, I was just putting it out there 😉 (edited)

nacin [15:22]
1) It’s a bit goofy to hide the tab outright because we don’t do an API request for which tabs to show. (Though we could piggyback on existing tabs.)

2) It’s a bit of gamification to tell them they need to install a few plugins to get some recommendations.

3) It offers an explanation for what “Recommended” is — perhaps we should be doing this anyway, so people understand.

4) I’m not against leaving it as-is, but we should add a note.

tellyworth [15:23]
The default fallback could be something like a popular list but a bit different (perhaps influenced by WP version, language, theme). That’s something we can tweak over time without needing core changes.

tellyworth [15:21]
ocean90, if forcing an update check doesn’t help, can you post steps to the ticket please? 30337.

jeffr0 [15:21]
I tested the tab earlier today and saw a list of Recommended plugins. I have 28 installed

johnbillion [15:21]
This is why it was originally suggested to replace the Popular tab

richardtape [15:21]
If we don’t have recommendations to make, should we show the tab at all?

ocean90 [15:21]
tellyworth: Will let you know, yes.

tellyworth [15:21]
It can always recommend something. There’s no reason for the results to be empty.

johnbillion [15:21]
Recommended doesn’t necessarily mean personalised

davidlaietta [15:21]
Couldn’t popular be consider recommendations in that case @richardtape

richardtape [15:22]
that was my thought too, I was just putting it out there 😉 (edited)

nacin [15:22]
1) It’s a bit goofy to hide the tab outright because we don’t do an API request for which tabs to show. (Though we could piggyback on existing tabs.)

2) It’s a bit of gamification to tell them they need to install a few plugins to get some recommendations.

3) It offers an explanation for what “Recommended” is — perhaps we should be doing this anyway, so people understand.

4) I’m not against leaving it as-is, but we should add a note.

tellyworth [15:23]
The default fallback could be something like a popular list but a bit different (perhaps influenced by WP version, language, theme). That’s something we can tweak over time without needing core changes.

jeffr0 [15:23]
Just to be clear, the Recommendations are driven by data and no human interaction?

tellyworth [15:24]
correct

melchoyce [15:24]
@nacin: +1

tellyworth [15:24]
Sorry, gotta run. Will catch up on scrollback later.

nacin [15:24]
“Customers Who Bought This Item Also Bought” – Amazon

nacin [15:25]
“These recommendations are based on what plugins others have installed who also have the plugins you have.” – someone wordsmith this please, I’d like it for the about page and plugin-install

charlestonsw [15:25]
FWIW as a “newb” to this build I had no idea what that tab was doing until 30s ago, thought it was broken.

nacin [15:26]
OK, we’ll wordsmith something.

nacin [15:26]
Can move along I think.

johnbillion [15:26]
Let’s move details of this onto the ticket

johnbillion [15:26]
We can re-open it if necessary

siobhan [15:32]
“WordPress users who installed this plugin also installed….”

sabreuse [15:33]
“WordPress sites similar to yours also use…”

Strings

johnbillion [15:16]
l10nL10n Localization, or the act of translating code into one's own language. Also see internationalization. Often written with an uppercase L so it is not confused with the capital letter i or the numeral 1. WordPress has a capable and dynamic group of polyglots who take WordPress to more than 70 different locales. in general – we have a pending string change for the DFW help text, and we have the About page text which will land (without images) tonight

Hopefully we are now string frozen apart from that

nacin [15:17]
by tonight you mean your tonight (he’s in the UK, folks)

nacin [15:17]
so soon, and pre-RC

API Docs

johnbillion [15:26]
We’ve had several posts on make/core detailing the API changes in 4.1 such as nested queries, title tags, etc

johnbillion [15:28]
These need moving into the plugin and theme handbooks but these aren’t editable by everyone unlike the Codex

nacin [15:28]
or also into the codex where appropriate

johnbillion [15:28]
Docs people, how’s best to manage that?

nacin [15:29]
I’m not sure the theme handbook is done/live yet, or if it will be by next week

johnbillion [15:29]
It’s there but it’s not “live”

sam [15:29]
I won’t be “officially” live, but it’s live if you know go directly to a page.

sam [15:30]
The plugin handbook is live live.

nacin [15:31]
OK, so for the theme handbook, I think that mostly applies to template tagtag A directory in Subversion. WordPress uses tags to store a single snapshot of a version (3.6, 3.6.1, etc.), the common convention of tags in version control systems. (Not to be confused with post tags.) pages, I think the only thing that needs true documenting is the title tags part, and there’s possibly a codex page already that it could be dumped on for now

sewmyheadon [15:32]
I think it’s probably a good idea to stick them in the Codex too until the Handbooks are further along and commonly used, no?
johnbillion [15:33]
How’s best to manage getting these changes into the handbook(s) then?

drew [15:34]
@johnbillion: Docs team has office hours tomorrow. We can probably talk about additions/adjustments related to 4.1 then. (edited)

johnbillion [15:34]
Perfect

karmatosed [15:35]
johnbillion I’m happy to work on changes to theme handbook if want?

johnbillion [15:35]
Similar note for the 4.1 page on the Codex then, let’s discuss it in the docs meeting tomorrow

johnbillion [15:35]
It just needs some polish

jcastaneda [15:35]
I might be able to help with those docs too

karmatosed [15:35]
:simple_smile:

jcastaneda [15:35]
just need xena tapes and hot pockets

bobbiewilsonatx [15:35]
I can help if needed with docs

BetaBeta A pre-release of software that is given out to a large group of users to trial under real conditions. Beta versions have gone through alpha testing in-house and are generally fairly close in look, feel and function to the final product; however, design changes often occur as part of the process. Forums

johnbillion [15:37]
Good stuff

johnbillion [15:38]
Moving on

johnbillion [15:38]
Forums

johnbillion [15:38]
We’ll need lots of eyes on the forums over the next few days

ipstenu [15:39]
Distressingly quiet. I’ve been looking all over ’em too :disappointed: Where are my angry people? I hardly know what to do!

nacin [15:39]
https://wordpress.org/support/forum/alphabeta

johnbillion [15:39]
Alpha/beta forum is dead

nacin [15:39]
we’ll just have to hope that RC annoys them

clorith [15:39]
It’s really quiet around this one, it’s almsot too quiet

ipstenu [15:39]
It does make me worry that we just don’t have enough plugin/theme devs testing right now because of the holiday season.

johnbillion [15:39]
@jeffr0 made a point that we didn’t advertise beta 2 much which may have contributed

stephdau [15:40]
clorith: december… :simple_smile:

nacin [15:40]
@johnbillion: surely did

nacin [15:40]
we snuck it out with a security release

nacin [15:40]
that’s OK though

Plugin Dev Email

jeffr0 [15:40]
Whatever happened to the emails to plugin and theme developers which let them know about specific changes coming up in the next version that they may want to test on?

nacin [15:40]
we have a few days to really get some final testing and feedback

clorith [15:40]
I saw more outrage about the patchpatch A special text file that describes changes to code, by identifying the files and lines which are added, removed, and altered. It may also be referred to as a diff. A patch can be applied to a codebase for testing. than anything else, haha (edited)

nacin [15:41]
jeffr0: on the agenda, we’re going to have it go out once RC goes out

bobbiewilsonatx [15:41]
+1 @jeffr0

johnbillion [15:41]
Yep

johnbillion [15:41]
Maybe that’s something that we should look at doing earlier in the release cycle rather than with RC

nacin [15:42]
yes and no – might have been possible this time because so much was documented on make/core already

nacin [15:42]
the last two times we did it within a day of the release. this will be more like a week.

ipstenu [15:42]
And thank goodness for that @nacin :simple_smile: I hate cleaning up the bounces the day of a release.

nacin [15:43]
that will also mean a lot of people will ideally report things

johnbillion [15:43]
On a similar note, for all you plugin developers here, now is the time to update your “Tested up to” versions

johnbillion [15:43]
Because you’ve all been testing beta of course

nacin [15:43]
the email will bother you about that

johnbillion [15:43]
This will also go out in the email

About Page

johnbillion [15:44]
The ‘About’ page text – this is sitting in a Google doc at the moment

johnbillion [15:45]
@helen You mentioned you’d be happy to look at the layout along with @melchoyce

johnbillion [15:45]
Want me to patch the text or are you happy doing that?

nacin [15:45]
we should ideally land the text (even sans design around it) in the RC

nacin [15:45]
not for translators, but for people testing

melchoyce [15:45]
It’s also easier to design around with the text in

nacin [15:46]
to know what to test

helen [15:46]
@johnbillion: can handle the patching, @melchoyce is @ryelle still up for this as well?

melchoyce [15:46]
Yup

ryelle [15:46]
yes :simple_smile:

jorbin [15:46]
I’m also happy to contribute.

helen [15:47]
cool. i’ll add you to the doc.

nacin [15:47]
there are just two things left in it, a possible bullet on plugin recommendations (I think @siobhan has point on wording for this) and what to call focus

nacin [15:47]
@johnbillion: mind if I?

johnbillion [15:47]
Go for it

stevegrunwell [15:48]
A few suggestions?

“These plugins are recommended for you based on similar WordPress sites:”
“These plugins may be of interest to you based on the plugins you already have installed:”
“Based on your current site, you might be interested in:”
“WordPress sites similar to yours often install:”
“Based on the plugins you’re already using, you might like:”
“WordPress sites that use the same plugins as you also use:”
“These plugin recommendations are based on what other similar WordPress users have installed:”

nacin [15:48]
@stevegrunwell: thanks. @siobhan, some nuggets here maybe ^

mark [15:48]
I came up with:

Similar WordPress sites also use…
Recommended based on plugins you use…

jorbin [15:49]
@siobhan: there are also some suggestions on #30337

WordPress TracTrac An open source project by Edgewall Software that serves as a bug tracker and project management tool for WordPress. [15:49]
#30337: Recommended plugins to replace Popular plugins tab
https://core.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/30337

miqrogroove [15:49]
“It looks like you might like these plugins:”

melchoyce [15:53]
@johnbillion: When do you want an About page first draft design by?

johnbillion [15:54]
@melchoyce Friday would be great

Focus

nacin [15:49]
_fullscreen_. _distraction-free writing_. _zen mode_. _focus_. these are all things we and others have used to roughly describe our original writing mode.

this isn’t a fullscreen mode or anything like that

mark [15:50]
It isn’t, and that’s up to the browser, so I’d not call it that.

nacin [15:51]
@mark and I have set a lot of the tone for the past something like 7 or 8 about pages and how features get described. when we were going over it, we came up with an alternative.

nacin [15:52]
we realized that this more or less splits two separate paradigms for working in WordPress: editing and writing

nacin [15:52]
we’ve been talking about these being necessarily different paradigms for a while

nacin [15:52]
this is a pretty good step to doing it

miqrogroove [15:52]
It reminds me what word processors used to look like before all the side panels and ribbon bars. (edited)

nacin [15:52]
we also used to have a tagline (in the old fullscreen, from 3.2–4.0, R.I.P.) that Matt liked, which was _Just write._

danielbachhuber [15:53]
does anyone actually _use_ Focus on a regular basis? (edited)

azaozz [15:53]
@danielbachhuber: yes, but not many people

miqrogroove [15:53]
Document Mode?

nacin [15:54]
So, here’s what we’re proposing for the about page:
>_*Distraction-free writing*_
>_Just write._ Sometimes, you just need to concentrate on putting your thoughts into words. Try turning on *Write mode*. When you start typing, all the distractions will fade away, letting you focus solely on your writing. All your editing tools instantly return when you need them.

danielbachhuber [15:54]
@azaozz: meaning … usage stats from WPcom?

mark [15:54]
@danielbachhuber: I do, now that I don’t have to specifically click into it teach time and now that it isn’t a less functional mode.

miqrogroove [15:54]
Write mode sounds like pen recognition.

azaozz [15:54]
@danielbachhuber: yep

danielbachhuber [15:55]
nods

danielbachhuber [15:55]
am I the only one that finds it distracting?

clorith [15:55]
Write mode does sound a bit strange to me

mark [15:55]
Scrivener calls it “Composition mode”

jeffr0 [15:55]
Maybe call it Ghost mode or is that trademarked?

drew [15:55]
I thought it was at first, but I really like it now after leaving it on for a couple of weeks.

danielbachhuber [15:56]
if I am, I’ll shut up about it — just curious why it’s still in core

jorbin [15:56]
I think the new version is vastly superior. I have it off by default, but enable it much more often now.

clorith [15:56]
danielbachhuber: I found it strange at first with all the empty whitespace, but I must also admit that it grows on you if you use it

ipstenu [15:56]
What @mark said, now that it’s just ON I use it a lot.

nacin [15:56]
@danielbachhuber: you are either 3 weeks, 3 months, or 3 years late to asking that question, depending on the mileston you wish to anchor a calculation on. :simple_smile: (edited)

azaozz [15:57]
@nacin: that sounds great. Should we change the text in the screen’s Help a bit too?

nacin [15:57]
@azaozz: that’s why I called off that patch earlier, yep.

danielbachhuber [15:57]
been spending my time on this whole API thing :simple_smile:

miqrogroove [15:57]
@mark I like “Composition mode”

nacin [15:57]
@danielbachhuber: I hear you. The security slackSlack Slack is a Collaborative Group Chat Platform https://slack.com/. The WordPress community has its own Slack Channel at https://make.wordpress.org/chat/. room has an air mattress for me, I’m pretty sure.

aramzs [15:57]
@danielbachhuber I like it the new way, but yeah, I found that the distraction free writing mode was a good sort of gateway drug to moving people from starting to write in Word to starting to write in WP

nacin [15:58]
If you think about how you needed to toggle it whenever you wanted to get in and out of it, it’s much less annoying than it used to be. As others said, it’s a matter of preference whether you want to leave it off most of the time, toggle it often, or leave it on.

jorbin [15:58]
@nacin: an air mattress implies you actually get sleep

stevegrunwell [15:58]
the word “immersive” comes to mind

danielbachhuber [15:58]
fair enough, carry on then — pardon my distraction

stevegrunwell [15:58]
but that might get lost on some people

nacin [15:59]
@danielbachhuber: no problem. honestly, it’s a perfectly acceptable thought to want to disable it. :simple_smile: (edited)

miqrogroove [15:59]
Eventually people will just wonder how they ever lived without it.

helen [15:59]
i think “writing mode” might work (as opposed to “write mode”), “composition mode” reads weird to me but i have a pretty specific bias about what composition means. :simple_smile:

clorith [16:00]
What about “author mode”, sort of combines them all ? (edited)

mark [16:00]
“Composition” is more technical-sounding. “Writing mode” isn’t bad.

rmccue [16:00]
Agreed on “composition” sounding weird at the least.

stephdau [16:00]
must run, ttyl all

nacin [16:00]
I could go for “writing”. “write” suggests “edit” when it should really be “editing” (versus “writing”).

mark [16:00]
“Author mode” might confuse as that is a role and an attribute of the post.

nacin [16:00]
I was not lost on me that “write mode” sounded like it was missing a gerund or something to soften it.

bobbiewilsonatx [16:01]
Zero mode? Intense mode?

petya [16:01]
Writing mode is great.

nacin [16:01]
_*Distraction-free writing*_
>_Just write._ Sometimes, you just need to concentrate on putting your thoughts into words. Try turning on *writing mode*. When you start typing, all the distractions will fade away, letting you focus solely on your writing. All your editing tools instantly return when you need them.

nacin [16:01]
(Capital W optional. (Capital Ps are never optional.))

quasel [16:01]
distraction free writing – is a common use term for it afaik

miqrogroove [16:01]
“Try the new Writing mode”

mark [16:01]
Yeah, and that’s still in the title for the section.

rmccue [16:01]
Distraction free, and make the button “Toggle distractions” :simple_smile:

jeffr0 [16:01]
Makes me wonder what mode I need to be in to write a post.

afercia [16:01]
JWM Just Write Mode

aubreypwd [16:02]
Creative Mode?

nacin [16:02]
FWIW, I love “Toggle distractions”

braulioaquino [16:02]
Focus mode

nacin [16:02]
@johnbillion: what do you think?

clorith [16:02]
I kinda like “Toggle distractions”

stevegrunwell [16:02]
Agree w/ @jeffr0 – it seems like Vim modes

bobbiewilsonatx [16:02]
Flow mode?

jorbin [16:02]
I don’t like that. It implies that publishing is a distraction

jorbin [16:02]
and so are categories

nacin [16:02]
Agree, @jorbin.

johnbillion [16:02]
My preference is to stick with distraction free mode or distraction free writing. Anyhing else needs to remain fairly descriptive

radices [16:02]
Clear View

jorbin [16:03]
“Focus mode”

nacin [16:03]
Keep in mind this is basically just the tooltip for a button, and that’s it.

jorbin [16:03]
It implies distraction free, without saying it

siobhan [16:03]
I like Focus mode

mark [16:03]
Well, and how we talk about it.

siobhan [16:03]
because that is what it is supposed to encourage

rmccue [16:04]
I don’t like calling it a mode, is all. Really, these changes take it from a mode to being part of the normal editor.

helen [16:04]
i’ve been mentally calling it an “adaptive editor”, when taken together with the height expansion piece.

rmccue [16:04]
(And “Toggle distractions” is a kind of fun way of describing it)

aubreypwd [16:04]
“Get Focused” I like @siobhan idea that it implies focus

miqrogroove [16:04]
Menu-auto-hide

danielbachhuber [16:04]
what about “Just Focus”

kimparsell [16:04]
I agree with @johnbillion, re: keep it distraction-free mode or distraction-free writing.

bobbiewilsonatx [16:04]
Oh Focus Editor

danielbachhuber [16:04]
and then “Bring Me Back to Reality”

siobhan [16:05]
What about “Focus”

aubreypwd [16:05]
Get Focused / Back to Publishing

mark [16:05]
Downside of Distraction-free Writing is that it, erm, *focuses* on what it’s not.

ipstenu [16:06]
I like DFW still. “The new Distraction Free Writing mode no longer needs you to click every time you want to use it, it just knows you want to write and focuses on just that: writing.” (edited)

bobbiewilsonatx [16:06]
Change mode to view?

aramzs [16:06]
Could just go with “Simplify”

mark [16:06]
But DFW does describe it in plain terms. I don’t think people will wonder about its purpose.

johnbillion [16:06]
^

rmccue [16:06]
I really like the button being “Focus”

pento [16:07]
Rabbit Hole Mode. 🙂

rmccue [16:07]
It’s enticing enough for new users to try it out :simple_smile:

nacin [16:07]
We need to figure out what the toggle button says, more than the about page.

stevegrunwell [16:07]
The View of Concentration

mark [16:07]
Focus / Disable Focus

boren [16:07]
When in “editing mode” those things aren’t distractions. If we’re going to acknowledge both modes, do we still label one as distracting?

miqrogroove [16:08]
“Hide Menus”

siobhan [16:08]
Focus / Reveal

rmccue [16:08]
By the way, I’m assuming we don’t have anything else to talk about on this nuclear power plant we’re building :simple_smile:

johnbillion [16:08]
I think we need to move along otherwise we’ll be here all night

janneke [16:09]
“Think of it as a standup meeting. Rapid fire is key, moving on when it’s appropriate is key, quickly disposing of lesser priority items is key.”

azaozz [16:09]
^

mark [16:09]
Indeed. Got some good feedback to digest.

boren [16:09]
Never name things in a meeting. :simple_smile:

siobhan [16:09]
paint it pink, paint it pink!

johnbillion [16:10]
Let’s leave it with mark and nacin to make a decision

Release Schedule

johnbillion [16:10]
Release schedule for Monday

johnbillion [16:11]
We usually aim for around 3pm eastern, correct?

nacin [16:11]
Thanks everyone for your input.

siobhan [16:11]
:simple_smile:

nacin [16:11]
@johnbillion noon for major releases, typically

kimparsell [16:12]
@johnbillion: Do you still want to have a status update meeting on Sunday?

mark [16:12]
Noon is good, because it’s waking time for all of the Americas and Europe.

nacin [16:12]
I wouldn’t mind scheduling it for Tuesday and doing a dry run Monday, also helps to ensure everything is in order from over the weekend (otherwise we are fixing bugs on Sunday).

helen [16:12]
i would definitely recommend a dry run pre-freeze.

jorbin [16:13]
I think Tuesday is a better target than Monday

jorbin [16:13]
It’s holiday time, people are busy and we are doing a very short RC

kimparsell [16:14]
^Agreed.

jorbin [16:14]
Allowing all weekend for testing rather then only up until mid day sunday will help get more themes and plugins tested

markoheijnen [16:14]
For us as in 1&1 I rather have it sooner then later

ipstenu [16:14]
Hanukkah Release! I don’t think Monday or Tuesday is any better, thinking about who will and won’t be around. Aiming for Monday means more room if we have to fall back.

nacin [16:14]
I did originally suggest to @johnbillion to aim for Monday, so mea culpa. (edited)

markoheijnen [16:14]
because of christmas for us

jeffr0 [16:14]
What is possibly being released next week, 4.1 final or 4.1 RC?

nacin [16:14]
Christmas for a lot 🙂

ipstenu [16:15]
(DreamHost maaaay be having our holiday party on the 16th…)

nacin [16:15]
4.1 RC tonight

nacin [16:15]
that would be 4.1’s target

iandstewart [16:15]
> 4.1 RC *tonight*

time zone?

nacin [16:16]
Alaska

johnbillion [16:16]
Eastern-ish. Late night GMT.

jorbin [16:16]
A monday release means only two business days of testing.

johnbillion [16:17]
A dry run on Monday isn’t such a bad idea

markoheijnen [16:18]
I will be testing together with someone from QA tomorrow and Friday (edited)

nacin [16:18]
@iandstewart American Samoa

iandstewart [16:18]
:simple_smile:

jorbin [16:18]
I’m heading out. I’ll catch up on the backchat

johnbillion [16:19]
I’d like to stick to Monday I think

johnbillion [16:21]
It’s more up to nacin and sam and co who’ll be deployingDeploy Launching code from a local development environment to the production web server, so that it's available to visitors. the 4.1 christmas present

nacin [16:21]
I’m not sure I like what that means for me or hosts on sunday

nacin [16:22]
I have to alert both hosts and one-click installers in advance

nacin [16:22]
Telling people their Monday is gonna suck even more is not fun

nacin [16:23]
Especially since something always comes up over the weekend and not enough people are around on Sundays in coordinated fashion to make decisions and commit stuff

nacin [16:23]
We can still slip from Tuesday to Wednesday and Wednesday to Thursday with no issue

sam [16:24]
I’d prefer Tuesday, yes.

nacin [16:24]
Thursdays aren’t an issue for a major releasemajor release A release, identified by the first two numbers (3.6), which is the focus of a full release cycle and feature development. WordPress uses decimaling count for major release versions, so 2.8, 2.9, 3.0, and 3.1 are sequential and comparable in scope. like they can be for security releases (as it’s Friday somewhere)

johnbillion [16:24]
Tuesday it is

johnbillion [16:24]
Decision made

markoheijnen [16:25]
As a host we rather have it early in the week then on a Thursday. Specially for us since that means Friday

rdall [16:26]
I rather deal with somthing bad on Monday then waking up to something bad on Monday. If that makes sense to anyone but me.

mark [16:26]
Tuesday. What’s next?

johnbillion [16:26]
I’d like to have a meeting of sorts on Sunday afternoon Eastern, which will take the form of a status check-in to see what the forums look like, what the trunktrunk A directory in Subversion containing the latest development code in preparation for the next major release cycle. If you are running "trunk", then you are on the latest revision. report looks like

nacin [16:26]
Works for me.

johnbillion [16:27]
So those who are around at the weekend, you are invited

kimparsell [16:27]
What time?

clorith [16:27]
Will be here :simple_smile:

markoheijnen [16:28]
I do want to note that the last couple of releases the information to hosts wasn’t as optimal as it could have been. Moving the release date on the release date is quite hard to work with

nacin [16:28]
Hosts have yet to receive a notification that there is a release pending.

johnbillion [16:28]
3pm Eastern

nacin [16:28]
There has been no suggestion a release is coming today. The software is not in RC.

kimparsell [16:28]
That time works for me.

mike [16:28]
I dunno. I think we just now had a notification that it’s Tuesday

mike [16:28]
😉

clorith [16:29]
I think he might be referring to the projected timeline on wp.org

nacin [16:29]
any host actually paying close enough attention to care about what day it drops surely can realize the software isn’t in RC yet

clorith [16:29]
The one on https://wordpress.org/about/roadmap/

nacin [16:30]
“Planned”

markoheijnen [16:30]
I’m not saying I’m not but it’s hard to sell to my boss etc (edited)

nacin [16:30]
that’s not to say the deadline couldn’t be updated before today, but it’s also a concern that moving the deadline slows momentum from contributors, and that keeping it unaltered publicly is the only way to ensure the deadline is always just barely unattainable

clorith [16:30]
Yup, but people can be quite literal at times when there’s a full date spelled out :simple_smile:

Milestone

johnbillion [16:32]

Final thing from me then

johnbillion [16:32]
https://core.trac.wordpress.org/query?status=!closed&version=trunk&order=modified

johnbillion [16:32]
This is the trunk report, it could do with some continued triaging. @boone has been working through it today

nacin [16:32]
slightly smaller and grouped: https://core.trac.wordpress.org/query?status=!closed&version=trunk&order=modified&milestone=Awaiting+Review&group=type