JulienMelissas 10:53 pm on December 3, 2017

Hey all! Happy to now…

Hey all! Happy to now be part of the metaMeta Meta is a term that refers to the inside workings of a group. For us, this is the team that works on internal WordPress sites like WordCamp Central and Make WordPress. community. Just wanted to start this discussion:

As an organizer and frequent attendee, I notice the job board could be a much better experience for people submitting to the job board (writing down post-it notes, whiteboards, etc), as well as people viewing. Additionally, I’d love to see a more accessible solution for those who might not be able to see or physically visit the “job board”

My proposal after talking with @iandunn is to possibly digitize the job board process. This would have 2 components: a form to submit postings (a posting would be a comment, as they inherently have approve/deny functionality) as well as a digital board built with JavaScriptJavaScript JavaScript or JS is an object-oriented computer programming language commonly used to create interactive effects within web browsers. WordPress makes extensive use of JS for a better user experience. While PHP is executed on the server, JS executes within a user’s browser. https://www.javascript.com/. that could refresh at some time interval.

If this seems like an interesting thing, I would be interested in working on an MVPMinimum Viable Product "A minimum viable product (MVP) is a product with just enough features to satisfy early customers, and to provide feedback for future product development." - WikiPedia or Proof of Concept. Also would love to hear comments, feedback, or suggestions.

Thanks!

Ulrich 1:25 am on December 4, 2017

I feel this is competing with an existing “job board”. https://jobs.wordpress.net/

What I find cool about the physical job boards is that they are local. So both the people looking for jobs and those looking for people are in the same area.

Normally someone from the organising team takes a photo of the job board so that it is available on Twitter.

It is cool that you want to work on this though I do think there are other issues that would make life easier for WordCampWordCamp WordCamps are casual, locally-organized conferences covering everything related to WordPress. They're one of the places where the WordPress community comes together to teach one another what they’ve learned throughout the year and share the joy. Learn more. organisers.
- JulienMelissas 5:32 am on December 4, 2017
  
  Hello @grapplerulrich, thanks for your thoughts and the reply. Maybe I didn’t define this one’s purpose or my thoughts behind it enough.
  
  This would be a job board specifically for each WordCampWordCamp WordCamps are casual, locally-organized conferences covering everything related to WordPress. They're one of the places where the WordPress community comes together to teach one another what they’ve learned throughout the year and share the joy. Learn more.. I think it might be much more efficient (and readable) replacement for the normal whiteboard or post-it situation. I was thinking the posting would maybe be powered by a computer somewhere in the WordCamp’s space. So it wouldn’t be available for everyone to add things to, but everyone could view it.
  
  A picture on twitter is not very readable nor accessible to people who need to use screenreaders.
  
  Do these details help? Maybe I should make up a mock up or something like that.
  - Ulrich 4:35 pm on December 4, 2017
    
    I think it would be better if we could extend the existing job board with a new taxonomyTaxonomy A taxonomy is a way to group things together. In WordPress, some common taxonomies are category, link, tag, or post format. https://codex.wordpress.org/Taxonomies#Default_Taxonomies. for the WordCamps. The jobs expire after 21 days so that works well.
    
    I would not recommend leaving a laptop out for people to enter the jobs as there has been already a report of a laptop being stolen from a WordCampWordCamp WordCamps are casual, locally-organized conferences covering everything related to WordPress. They're one of the places where the WordPress community comes together to teach one another what they’ve learned throughout the year and share the joy. Learn more..
    
    A simple MVPMinimum Viable Product "A minimum viable product (MVP) is a product with just enough features to satisfy early customers, and to provide feedback for future product development." - WikiPedia could be also just creating a page or blog post and letting people adding their jobs as comments.
    - JulienMelissas 7:33 pm on December 4, 2017
      
      Makes sense, and not a bad MVPMinimum Viable Product "A minimum viable product (MVP) is a product with just enough features to satisfy early customers, and to provide feedback for future product development." - WikiPedia idea! I might try it at the next WordCampWordCamp WordCamps are casual, locally-organized conferences covering everything related to WordPress. They're one of the places where the WordPress community comes together to teach one another what they’ve learned throughout the year and share the joy. Learn more. Asheville, but then again I think I’ll probably just build my MVP for fun 😉
      
      They make locks for many types of laptops. And iPad with a locking case would work as well, but yes I think this is something to be considered. Every WordCamp wouldn’t “have” to use it.
      
      I do think having one “board” interface would still be the most helpful, so adding it to the existing job board would still require us building a more friendly, scoped interface.
      - Kevin Hoffman 8:20 pm on December 4, 2017
        
        We should also consider that the input doesn’t need to be tied to the display. Attendees could post to the board on their own laptops/mobile devices through a special link. We’d obviously want to be wary of that link being abused if it was publicized, but maybe there is some type of basic check that we could do to compare the poster’s email to the list of attendee emails. In addition I think all posts need manually approved just as a second check against Code of ConductCode of Conduct “A code of conduct is a set of rules outlining the norms, rules, and responsibilities or proper practices of an individual party.” - Wikipedia.
        
        JulienMelissas 8:34 pm on December 4, 2017
        
        Attendees could post to the board on their own laptops/mobile devices through a special link.
        
        I thought of this as well!
        
        In addition I think all posts need manually approved just as a second check against Code of ConductCode of Conduct “A code of conduct is a set of rules outlining the norms, rules, and responsibilities or proper practices of an individual party.” - Wikipedia.
        
        As a WordCampWordCamp WordCamps are casual, locally-organized conferences covering everything related to WordPress. They're one of the places where the WordPress community comes together to teach one another what they’ve learned throughout the year and share the joy. Learn more. organizer, this might be harder to get a person to do this, but the “approve, deny” process of comments is already built in and MUCH easier (and more accountable in case there is a dispute) than wiping a violation of the CoCCode of Conduct “A code of conduct is a set of rules outlining the norms, rules, and responsibilities or proper practices of an individual party.” - Wikipedia off the board haha.
JulienMelissas 7:33 pm on December 4, 2017

Here’s an example of why I think we could use this functionality: https://twitter.com/kevinwhoffman/status/937758414159130627
- Kevin Hoffman 8:14 pm on December 4, 2017
  Julien, thanks for leading the conversation here. After seeing the white board version in person this weekend at WCUSWCUS WordCamp US. The US flagship WordCamp event. and then transcribing it, I came to a similar conclusion about the benefits of a digital job board. While the white board approach is charming, it has a number of issues:
  - AccessibilityAccessibility Accessibility (commonly shortened to a11y) refers to the design of products, devices, services, or environments for people with disabilities. The concept of accessible design ensures both “direct access” (i.e. unassisted) and “indirect access” meaning compatibility with a person’s assistive technology (for example, computer screen readers). (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accessibility) is the most obvious and most important issue. It’s difficult/impossible for the visually impaired or handicapped to see or access a job board in a single physical location, even if they are at the same WordCampWordCamp WordCamps are casual, locally-organized conferences covering everything related to WordPress. They're one of the places where the WordPress community comes together to teach one another what they’ve learned throughout the year and share the joy. Learn more..
  - As I transcribed the board, I had trouble discerning whether many of the posts were from those looking for a job or those looking to hire. “Front-end developerFront-end developer Front-end web development is the practice of producing HTML, CSS and JavaScript for a website or a web application which a user can view and interact directly.” with a website link could be interpreted as either.
  - The scattered layout of the board (which indeed looks cool as a composition) is not conducive to scanning information. Attempting to scan a board with no logical structure means many postings will be missed. Is our goal to create a cool piece of art or to actually communicate job openings?
  - Handwriting issues. When transcribing, I had to look up about 25% of the postings to make sure I had the correct URLURL A specific web address of a website or web page on the Internet, such as a website’s URL www.wordpress.org or email address to ensure I was linking to the right place.
  A digital job board could address all of the above issues with some additional benefits that come along with structured, digital data. I honestly did not know that https://jobs.wordpress.net/ existed before today, so thanks Ulrich for bringing that up. I don’t see these two ideas as competing. In fact, I think the type of digital job board that Julien is describing could integrate with the existing online job board assuming the WP REST APIREST API The REST API is an acronym for the RESTful Application Program Interface (API) that uses HTTP requests to GET, PUT, POST and DELETE data. It is how the front end of an application (think “phone app” or “website”) can communicate with the data store (think “database” or “file system”) https://developer.wordpress.org/rest-api/. is enabled.
  
  Here’s how I see the two working together:
  - Digital Job Board at WordCamp – A visually rich presentation of job postings that is fun to look at while still being clear and accessible. For example, I could see a job post with the company name, open position, and a photo of the team inviting job seekers to meet them at their booth. Maybe it’s a masonry layout of these posts that animate in and out as attendees stop to check it out. Maybe there is even opportunity for sponsorship here with special listings.
  - Job Board on jobs.wordpress.net – This board could be populated via the WP REST API by submissions that take place at the WordCamp. In this way the same posts that appear on the digital job board at WordCamp end up on jobs.wordpress.net for posterity.
  So I definitely see the two being able to work together. Let’s make it happen.
JulienMelissas 8:29 pm on December 4, 2017

Thanks for your thoughtful response Kevin!

I don’t see these two ideas as competing. In fact, I think the type of digital job board that Julien is describing could integrate with the existing online job board assuming the WP REST APIREST API The REST API is an acronym for the RESTful Application Program Interface (API) that uses HTTP requests to GET, PUT, POST and DELETE data. It is how the front end of an application (think “phone app” or “website”) can communicate with the data store (think “database” or “file system”) https://developer.wordpress.org/rest-api/. is enabled.

Exactly what I was thinking. If we use the REST API I think we could easily offer a lot of ways for people to make this their own, and if we can come up with a basic interface to display the job postings, it would solve a lot of use-cases.
- Kevin Hoffman 9:16 pm on December 4, 2017
  
  For sure. To address the primary accessibilityAccessibility Accessibility (commonly shortened to a11y) refers to the design of products, devices, services, or environments for people with disabilities. The concept of accessible design ensures both “direct access” (i.e. unassisted) and “indirect access” meaning compatibility with a person’s assistive technology (for example, computer screen readers). (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accessibility) issue, the job board should also be accessible at a dedicated URLURL A specific web address of a website or web page on the Internet, such as a website’s URL www.wordpress.org throughout the WordCampWordCamp WordCamps are casual, locally-organized conferences covering everything related to WordPress. They're one of the places where the WordPress community comes together to teach one another what they’ve learned throughout the year and share the joy. Learn more. for anyone who needs text to speech.
  - Amanda Rush 10:41 pm on December 4, 2017
    
    Hi all,
    
    Since I’m the one who posted the request on Twitter for the job board transcription, I thought I’d offer some thoughts. Obviously, it should be accessible. Even when I travel to a WordCampWordCamp WordCamps are casual, locally-organized conferences covering everything related to WordPress. They're one of the places where the WordPress community comes together to teach one another what they’ve learned throughout the year and share the joy. Learn more., there’s no way for me to read what’s on the local job board, or add to it without seeking the assistance of someone else to do the reading or writing. That being said, I think posting should be limited to WordCamp attendees. For example, the WCUSWCUS WordCamp US. The US flagship WordCamp event. job board should be limited to WCUS attendees. This would preserve the local nature of the job board, which I think should stay because it’s in keeping with the spirit of local WordCamps, and there’s no reason why making an accessible version needs to do away with that. Security too, obviously, because in lots and lots of cases there’s no fundamental conflict between accessibilityAccessibility Accessibility (commonly shortened to a11y) refers to the design of products, devices, services, or environments for people with disabilities. The concept of accessible design ensures both “direct access” (i.e. unassisted) and “indirect access” meaning compatibility with a person’s assistive technology (for example, computer screen readers). (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accessibility) and security. I think if the already-existing jobs.wordpress.net can be extended, then that would probably be better than creating an entirely separate resource.
    - JulienMelissas 10:52 pm on December 4, 2017
      
      Amanda! Thank you for chiming in and I appreciate your expertise. This was one of my primary thoughts this weekend when it dawned on me that a whiteboard simply wasn’t cutting it, along with the scrunched text and hard-to-read handwriting. I have a little bit of experience with building accessible JS applications so I think with some testing it will be possible to come up with a solution that works for all.
      
      I appreciate your input and I think that these are all good points. I also don’t know how “open” this should be or not be when it comes to both posting or viewing, but for an MVPMinimum Viable Product "A minimum viable product (MVP) is a product with just enough features to satisfy early customers, and to provide feedback for future product development." - WikiPedia I will probably just make the application portable so we can put it whenever it ends up needing to be, maybe in a shortcodeShortcode A shortcode is a placeholder used within a WordPress post, page, or widget to insert a form or function generated by a plugin in a specific location on your site. or something. One thought is we could use a protected post to show/hide it?
      
      I’m going to look into some of the code behind the jobs site and maybe how we might be able to integrate it into that, or possibly the CampTix pluginPlugin A plugin is a piece of software containing a group of functions that can be added to a WordPress website. They can extend functionality or add new features to your WordPress websites. WordPress plugins are written in the PHP programming language and integrate seamlessly with WordPress. These can be free in the WordPress.org Plugin Directory https://wordpress.org/plugins/ or can be cost-based plugin from a third-party, which I worked on this weekend at Contributor’s day.
    - Kevin Hoffman 12:02 am on December 5, 2017
      
      Thanks, Amanda. I share your concerns about how public the job board should be in terms of submitting posts, and I agree it should be limited to attendees and sponsors of that specific WordCampWordCamp WordCamps are casual, locally-organized conferences covering everything related to WordPress. They're one of the places where the WordPress community comes together to teach one another what they’ve learned throughout the year and share the joy. Learn more..
      
      Julien, I’m also thinking about how we may be able to populate the board ahead of time by potentially hooking into a few fields in the WordCamp registration form if an attendee indicates they are hiring or looking for a job. It’s still important to have a method to submit posts at the WordCamp, but we could have a lot of it in place before the event even begins.
Philip Arthur Moore 6:51 am on December 5, 2017

I absolutely love the idea of WordCampWordCamp WordCamps are casual, locally-organized conferences covering everything related to WordPress. They're one of the places where the WordPress community comes together to teach one another what they’ve learned throughout the year and share the joy. Learn more. job boards being as accessible as possible, and the example here is why. WordCamps, big or small, introduce WordPress to a number of new individuals, people seeking work, attendees seeking opportunities to connect with others, etc., and having a board that is a virtual goldmine of opportunity be readable just makes sense.

This is not at all related to the WordPress Jobs website. Think of people who are small business owners looking to connect and developers looking to connect with them. A pre-registration job form for a WordCamp would open an opportunity for them to meet in person and also allow people like me who cannot read scribble-writing that well to understand what I’m looking at.

I landed my job with Automattic by attending a WordCamp.

I met my eventual team lead, talked to him, connected, had no idea I would ever apply to Automattic, and a month or so later the rest was history. Now think how many times the same story could be said for people who landed a great job with a great person just because of a job board that wasn’t impossible to read?

A pre-registered job board + whiteboard + transcribed whiteboard would be incredible. I say this as a CEO now and I say this as my former self, a random WordPress developer looking to connect and get hired.
- Kevin Hoffman 7:07 am on December 5, 2017
  
  WordCampWordCamp WordCamps are casual, locally-organized conferences covering everything related to WordPress. They're one of the places where the WordPress community comes together to teach one another what they’ve learned throughout the year and share the joy. Learn more. was also the first step towards my current position with WordImpress. I met two of my future teammates and a month later began working with them. I would love to make that experience more common and I think a better job board is one such way to facilitate those conversations.
  
  I’ve looked into https://jobs.wordpress.net/ more thoroughly since originally posting, and I am also reconsidering whether these two ideas really do need to be coupled, or whether they serve two different purposes. The existing online job board excels at categorization by job type and location with long, detailed job descriptions.
  
  What we are talking about for WordCamps is something different. It should be a conversation starter that brings people together as quickly as possible in the limited time in which they share a common space.
- JulienMelissas 3:32 pm on December 5, 2017
  
  This is not at all related to the WordPress Jobs website. Think of people who are small business owners looking to connect and developers looking to connect with them.
  
  Philip – thanks for your input and story! I’m in full agreement with the above. Like Kevin, I’ve started to realize these are 2 different things.
  
  My MVPMinimum Viable Product "A minimum viable product (MVP) is a product with just enough features to satisfy early customers, and to provide feedback for future product development." - WikiPedia I’m working on right now is going to be built off adding comments to a page called “jobs” in the CampTix pluginPlugin A plugin is a piece of software containing a group of functions that can be added to a WordPress website. They can extend functionality or add new features to your WordPress websites. WordPress plugins are written in the PHP programming language and integrate seamlessly with WordPress. These can be free in the WordPress.org Plugin Directory https://wordpress.org/plugins/ or can be cost-based plugin from a third-party. This will at least get us something to start from and to discuss. Then, we can figure out what functionality is needed and also maybe get help from the design team, as that is not my expertise. I’m going to try and hack on it this weekend.
  - Ian Dunn 9:18 pm on December 7, 2017
    
    At first thought, I’m thinking this might make more sense as a standalone pluginPlugin A plugin is a piece of software containing a group of functions that can be added to a WordPress website. They can extend functionality or add new features to your WordPress websites. WordPress plugins are written in the PHP programming language and integrate seamlessly with WordPress. These can be free in the WordPress.org Plugin Directory https://wordpress.org/plugins/ or can be cost-based plugin from a third-party, rather than being tied to CampTix.
    
    Or maybe a CampTix addon, if you were thinking about integrating the `tix_attendee` post type for authentication or something?
    - JulienMelissas 9:39 pm on December 8, 2017
      
      Makes sense. Thanks Ian! Initially I’ll just make it it’s own pluginPlugin A plugin is a piece of software containing a group of functions that can be added to a WordPress website. They can extend functionality or add new features to your WordPress websites. WordPress plugins are written in the PHP programming language and integrate seamlessly with WordPress. These can be free in the WordPress.org Plugin Directory https://wordpress.org/plugins/ or can be cost-based plugin from a third-party. Eventually it might have to be an add-on because I was thinking we could check attendee emails and job poster emails against each other.

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