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  • John Blackbourn 8:22 pm on May 13, 2014 Permalink | Log in to leave a Comment
    Tags: agenda, ,   

    Agenda for tomorrow’s Multisite chat 

    We’re having a dev chat about Multisite in #wordpress-dev tomorrow (May 14, 2014 18:00 UTC). I’d like to split the chat into two main areas:

    1. Open vs. closed networks
    2. Everything else

    The concept of an open network where users can create their own sites was the popular impetus for WordPress MU, but is decidedly not the primary use case for multisite anymore. Most operate closed, trusted networks, where site signups are disabled (and often user signups are disabled as well).

    Back in October, Andrew Nacin published a collection of thoughts on potential changes to Multisite, one of which was the idea of open vs. closed networks. I’d like to discuss this concept and whether now is the right time to tackle it. Here are some relevant paragraphs from that post:

    When a network is not designed for “open registration”, there are a number of undue burdens that should be lifted for administrators. Uploadable file types are severely restricted, and the amount they can upload is capped. They cannot activate installed plugins, though there is an option for this. They cannot add users to their sites without knowing their email address (ostensibly to prevent spam), and the user must still go through a “confirmation” process. New sites must go through an “activation” process. They cannot create new users.

    I don’t think WordPress needs to decide that the multisite feature is only geared for closed networks. Rather, a single option — set on install, and controllable via network settings — can control this entire paradigm very effectively.

    Essentially, I am proposing we trust single-site administrators in a closed network to not be spammy, and to be given wide-ranging control of their own sites; but that we do not extend that trust to important areas of security.

    So, let’s discuss whether now is the time to introduce the concept of open vs. closed networks, what form it takes, and to which functionality it extends.

    • What differences should we see between an open network and a closed network?
      • Open user registration
      • Open site registration
      • Capabilities for regular Administrators (plugins, themes, users)
      • Email notifications (amount of, and wording in)
      • User listing and user editing UI differences
      • Site listing and site editing UI differences
      • Network admin dashboard UI differences
    • What form should the open vs. closed network option take? A UI option when installing multisite? Changeable after the fact or set in stone like subdir/subdomain option?
    • What changes need to be considered for existing multisite installs?

    Secondly, let’s discuss all other multisite improvements that we would like to see. Several may well be related to the idea of open vs. closed networks, and that’s ok. Here’s a list to get us started:

    • Reign Rein in notification emails when adding sites, users
    • Improve user searching – #27304
    • Improve user management
    • Better explanations for what archive/spam/delete does to a site
    • Merge in the Hyper Admins plugin
    • Merge in the User Management Tools plugin

    If anyone has particular issues they’d like addressed (bonus points for existing tickets on Trac), leave a comment and we’ll see what we can cover.

    Two other items worth mentioning are:

    • Domain mapping
    • SSL improvements

    I don’t think we’re yet at the stage where we could consider implementing domain mapping in core. It has a prerequisite of removing the subdirectory vs. subdomain paradigm, and we’re not near approaching that (unless someone wants to step up).

    Regarding SSL improvements, I’m planning on arranging a separate working group to tackle a whole raft of SSL improvements in core that aren’t just related to multisite. I’ll be publishing a separate post in the next couple of days to get us started.

     
    • Robert Dall 8:47 pm on May 13, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      I couldn’t agree more on adding the Hyper Admins and the User Management Tools into core. That makes a lot of sense.

      I could also see real benefit to the Domain Mapping and SSL Improvements.

      Here is why:

      I am actually in the middle of a project where I am using a multi-site for company that has 5 different websites that offer 5 different areas of the products and or services offered.

      So while we could use 5 different installs of WordPress were using the power of multisite to keep the admin to a minimum.

      Domain Mapping will be of great use to this and many other types of multisite usage.

      SSL and wildcard SSL is someone confusing to the uninitiated any improvement to WordPress multisite and SSL would be of great benefit.

    • Sallie Goetsch 8:49 pm on May 13, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      That’s “rein in.”

      However, I’m really glad to see Multisite getting some attention. I’m not qualified to help develop it, but I’ve noticed the lack of developments in the last several WordPress versions. What IS the status of domain mapping? Do you still need a plugin for it or not?

      Are there any plans to institute network-wide widget areas? Right now network-wide menus are possible with a plugin, but there’s no way to add network-wide widget areas at all.

      How about default theme settings that the network admin can control? I’ve got a project coming up where we’re actually leaning toward NOT using Multisite in part because the network admins would have to go in and configure theme options for each sub-site separately (even though they will be the SAME for each site, with the only difference being a different logo image). We could hack the theme up so it doesn’t have any other options, but that’s not really a good alternative, either.

      I realize these things are too much to ask for 4.0, but wanted to at least add them to the wishlist.

      Thanks!
      Sallie

      • John Blackbourn 3:07 pm on May 14, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        What IS the status of domain mapping? Do you still need a plugin for it or not?

        Yep, there’s no support in core for domain mapping currently.

        Are there any plans to institute network-wide widget areas? How about default theme settings that the network admin can control?

        Network-wide widgets, menus, and settings are an interesting idea and certainly something I’ve seen requested before. The complication comes when those widgets, menus, and settings need to be present on the main site, which may not be desirable. I’ll add it to the agenda!

    • Rouven Hurling 9:27 pm on May 13, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      i would love to see #15800 fixed, so that network wide plugins can add a tab the site edit where there can display their options (or in my case, data and options for that client and so on)

    • Knut Sparhell 1:29 pm on May 14, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      As long as the mulitisite setup can only be done from wp-config.php this should also be where to set a WP_IS_TRUSTED_NETWORK constant. You don’t specifically install a multisite, you install WordPress and transform it to mulitsite by editing wp-config.php.

      The spam site option may be removed unless some sites actually have it set already. The way links was deprecated is the way to go.

      Users should be registered through a signup process to avoid sending passwords over email. Single sites could also gain from a better signup process. For trusted networks this should be unified.

      There is a plugin for dealing with user activation keys, removing unused and unnecessary signups. This could be part of core.

      Shared media could also be something for the future, and have in mind.

      The important thing now is where to start, how to simplify things and not doing things that may block further evolution and flixibility.

      • John Blackbourn 3:10 pm on May 14, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        As long as the mulitisite setup can only be done from wp-config.php this should also be where to set a WP_IS_TRUSTED_NETWORK constant. You don’t specifically install a multisite, you install WordPress and transform it to mulitsite by editing wp-config.php.

        That’s not quite correct. You add the `WP_ALLOW_MULTISITE` constant but then you still need to go through the setup process in the admin area. This is where I imagine the open/closed network option will go.

        I agree with all your other points!

      • Boone Gorges 4:58 pm on May 14, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        > There is a plugin for dealing with user activation keys, removing unused and unnecessary signups. This could be part of core.

        Agreed that this is a problem. See also the new “Pending Users” feature in BuddyPress (http://wptavern.com/buddypress-2-0-to-add-signups-administration-screen – BP now creates the wp_signups table for non-multisite as well, to centralize signup management) and this plugin: http://wordpress.org/plugins/unconfirmed

    • Paal Joachim Romdahl 4:50 pm on May 19, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      An idea… brainstorming….
      What about having a Network page similar to a All Pages/All posts screen. Only here we can create connections. Create a new sub site or link with existing site.

      Create a new sub site options:

      • title, description and perhaps URL.
      • Optional check box for Domain.
      • Check boxes for Shared media, share posts, etc.
      • And probably other options.

      Link with existing site.

      • URL of site
      • Username and password.
      • Check boxes for shared media, share post etc.

      and more.

      This would really make it into a Network page that one can connect existing or new site.

  • Helen Hou-Sandi 2:49 pm on May 7, 2014 Permalink | Log in to leave a Comment
    Tags: , agenda   

    Agenda for the May 7 meeting 

    Please propose agenda items for today’s dev chat at 20:00 UTC. So far we have:

    • Go through the proposed list of ideas for 4.0 and get an idea of what’s feasible for the release and where interest lies. If you have an idea that’s not covered in the summary post or comments, please comment with what that is.
    • Determine if there’s a unifying theme of sorts between proposed features and enhancements.
    • Tickets/patches that really need early attention for a lengthy soak in trunk.
    • Places people are stuck – it’s still fairly early in the cycle, but let’s get in the habit of getting unstuck at every possible opportunity, both in and outside of scheduled meetings.

    If you have specific tickets to bring up, go ahead and list those in comments here as well so we can tackle them before or outside of the meeting as possible.

     
  • Andrew Nacin 5:25 am on April 21, 2014 Permalink | Log in to leave a Comment
    Tags: , , agenda   

    Let’s have a meeting in #wordpress-dev on April 21, 2014 18:00 UTC, to discuss WordPress 3.9.1 and triage those tickets. As preparation for the meeting:

    Reception has been overwhelmingly positive and, anecdotally at least, we’ve seen more issues as they relate to deliberately changed aspects (TinyMCE/editing) versus generic plugin breakage. I think we’re in pretty good shape based on the bug reports that have come in, but with automatic updates at our disposal, there’s no reason to wait three or four weeks before shipping 3.9.1.

    I think we should try to fix the big, obvious stuff by Tuesday and release 3.9.1 as early as Wednesday. Some of the reported issues are pretty core to TinyMCE 4.0 and the various rewrites it triggered (like image editing), which means many of them won’t be handled by 3.9.1. That’s quite OK, especially since some of these may require some upstream fixes in TinyMCE, and since there can always be a 3.9.2 in the weeks ahead.

    What I do want to do is have no “unknowns” — we should know exactly what regressed or otherwise is broken, under what circumstances, how major or minor it is, how high or low of a priority it should be, etc. That includes unit tests (if applicable) or at least clear test cases.

    cc @azaozz @helen @wonderboymusic @gcorne @avryl @mcsf @ehg @jeremyfelt @ocean90 @westonruter

     
    • Andrew Nacin 5:28 am on April 21, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      If you’re able to look through tickets in your domain ahead of the meeting that would make it go pretty quick, and we can cover them really at any point during the day (I’ll be around all day), I just wanted to make sure the ball gets rolling.

    • Weston Ruter 11:39 am on April 21, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Alas, I’ll be in the air at this time. Not sure I’ll have WiFi. I think widget customizer is in good shape for 3.9.1 with critical #27897 being committed and with minor #27878 having a patch.

    • greghall1 9:02 pm on April 25, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Hi Andrew,
      Not sure if this is where I should post this info.
      I upgraded two of my WP sites to 3.9 and have lost the thumbnails where I have manually arranged my galleries (this is how I set up the whole of both sites in my Hydra themed greghall.ca & monkeypencollective.com). I cannot add media as I am worried it will destroy my current and desired galleries throughout.
      Thanks,
      Greg Hall

  • Andrew Nacin 12:14 pm on April 15, 2014 Permalink | Log in to leave a Comment
    Tags: , agenda   

    Let’s have a meeting today, Tuesday April 15, 2014, 18:00 UTC, to make sure we have everything in place for a release. (#wordpress-dev)

     
  • Andrew Nacin 11:57 am on April 1, 2014 Permalink | Log in to leave a Comment
    Tags: , agenda   

    Agenda for the April 2 meeting 

    Please suggest items for the April 2 developer meeting. So far:

    • The wpdialog TinyMCE plugin and the enqueuing of jQuery UI Dialog ( #16284)
    • Transient/cache suspensions during widget previews ( #27538)
    • Any other show-stoppers or critical issues
    • Timing of Release Candidate 1
    • April 16 is our target release date of 3.9
     
  • Andrew Nacin 5:08 pm on March 12, 2014 Permalink
    Tags: agenda   

    As a reminder, the weekly meeting continues to be at 21:00 UTC.

    Daylight Saving Time has started in the U.S., which means the meeting is at 5 p.m. Eastern time, 2 p.m. Pacific. We will revert to 20:00 UTC on April 2, after Europe enters Daylight Saving Time.

    Our agenda for today will be to go over all 3.9 tasks and get an idea where we need the most resources, to ensure we are in a good position to close out the beta period in less than three weeks.

     
    • Robert Chapin 6:06 pm on March 12, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      It looks like I can join at least the first half of the meeting. There have been several iterations of the patch for #22692. It should be a comprehensive fix at this point. It will adjust quotes, smilies, and shortcodes so that their behaviors are normal in the presence of NBSP chars and entities. It also paves the way for refreshing patches in #26842, #8775, #20342, #23185, and many others. We could potentially clear out half of the wptexturize tickets if this gets the attention it deserves.

  • Andrew Nacin 8:15 am on February 12, 2014 Permalink
    Tags: agenda   

    Please suggest agenda items for the February 12 developer meeting.

    Aside from usual 3.9 stuff, we’re going to be using part of this meeting for brainstorming for GSoC.

    Here’s the agenda thread and meeting notes from last week, as a point of reference.

     
    • Jen Mylo 8:21 am on February 12, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      If people want to write up their ideas for GSoC projects in advance, that would be great in terms of keeping things going. I’ll be submitting our GSoC application immediately following the dev chat, so if anyone has ideas but won’t be at the meeting, go ahead and post them at http://codex.wordpress.org/GSoC2014. Thanks!

    • Rami Yushuvaev 12:20 pm on February 12, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      How about a “Road Map” for upgrading the minimum requirements to PHP 5.4 and MySQL 5.5 (or any other version you choose). The purpose of the roadmap is to set a time frame, not choosing technology.

      The roadmap should be spread over a long period of time (let’s say 2 years from now), enough time for web hosts to make the proper adjustments. WordPress has three major version per year, this means WordPress 4.4 will require the new minimum requirements.

      The road map will not be a binding, meaning that if core developers will decide to upgrade the minimum requirements in wp4.6 or wp4.8 the road map can be changed. BUT, setting a time table is important, for plugin developers, web hosts, and core developers. It allows everyone the get ready for the upcoming change.

      • Bryan Petty 7:34 pm on February 12, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        It’s been mentioned many times that we should not become “a protest piece at the expense of our users”, and this is specifically mentioned in regards to setting hard deadlines for bumping minimum server requirements. We cater to our users, not dictate what they need by abandoning millions of users at arbitrary points, especially if they still account for more than 10% of WP installations.

        We still haven’t dropped PHP 5.2 support, and given the rate of use shown in the stats, that still isn’t happening for another couple years. Dropping 5.3 is probably more than 5 or 6 years down the road, and isn’t even worth thinking about right now.

        When the time comes, you can be assured there will be plenty of notice, but it won’t even be necessary for most since it will only apply to less than 10% of users.

    • Dominik Schilling (ocean90) 3:11 pm on February 12, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      State of #27078 (Autoprefixer), #26669 (wp-admin.css split) and #26799 (Backbone update).

    • Daniel Bachhuber 3:29 pm on February 12, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      I’d like to discuss #316 if it’s not too big of a conversation.

    • Tom Auger 4:47 pm on February 12, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Let’s talk about all the great things that are happening with the Image Editor and Media Modal. I’m seeing the following tickets which are all tangential to each other: #24409 (which is awesome), #26672, #24567, #18947, #26870 (thank the gods), #21811 (which has turned into a much bigger deal than I thought) and #21810 (which seems to be a refresh of #19889).

      This all seems like “a thing”. @wonderboymusic, @gcorne and others seem to have things well in hand, but I’d like to see a little more sharing around all the great things that are going on, and where help / discussion / review is needed.

    • Aaron Jorbin 8:54 pm on February 12, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      I’d love to find out if anyone else has comments on #27023 and if people think grunt-patch is ready for me to tag it in npm and for us to add it.

    • Andrew Nacin 8:56 pm on February 12, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Agenda:

      • CSS/JS: Autoprefixer #27078, wp-admin.css #26669, Backbone update #26799
      • 3.9 status reports for teams/projects/tasks
      • Widgets Customizer merge: old style widgets + options API issue (details in the meeting)
      • Any other logjams or stuck situations we need to address
      • GSoC brainstorming

      We can hopefully get through all but the last point pretty quickly.

  • Andrew Nacin 3:26 am on February 5, 2014 Permalink
    Tags: , agenda   

    Please suggest agenda items for the weekly developer meeting, Wednesday, February 5, 21:00 UTC.

    If there’s a task or ticket we need to work through, or need volunteers for, let’s get those spelled out now. Maybe we can even work through some of them pre-meeting.

    I’ll again be asking for a sentence or two (or more, if necessary of course) from each person/team working on a 3.9 task. You can also post those here if you’d like — please cross-reference any relevant tickets or discussions. Worked out great last week. For the state of things as of last week, see Mike’s weekly roundup.

     
    • Pippin Williamson 4:05 am on February 5, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Not sure if there’s much discussion needed on them, but I’d love to see the remove/has_image_size() tickets shored up:

      https://core.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/26768
      https://core.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/26951

    • Jeremy Felt 4:19 am on February 5, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      I’d like to chat a bit about the direction of domain routing. I’ll be around pre-meeting as well.

      I opened #27003 last night with a patch that introduces `wp_get_network()` as a way to retrieve a network by it’s domain and path. This isn’t an absolutely necessary abstraction from `wpmu_current_site()`, but it does remove the functionality away from the `$current_site` global and focuses on retrieving just the requested information. In the process, `wpmu_current_site()` gets cleaned up quite a bit. It should be pretty straight forward to write unit tests that cover `wp_get_network()`.

      IMO, this is a first step toward cleaning up a bit of the load process. If we’re good with this direction, the next step will be to do the same thing for site discovery ($wpdb->blogs). I have more notes written up here on the multisite load process in general for anyone that wants an overview of how things are working.

    • Pippin Williamson 5:17 am on February 5, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      I’ll throw out another one. I’d LOVE to see further discussion on better custom comment types, per https://core.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/12668

    • Weston Ruter 8:14 am on February 5, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      There was a really good discussion today on #wordpress-dev regarding feedback for Widget Customizer. So I think we have a path forward for important issues to address. I’ve created a milestone on GitHub to track these issues: https://github.com/x-team/wp-widget-customizer/issues?milestone=4&state=open

    • Robert Chapin 11:27 am on February 5, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      3.9-early tickets, please

    • Manuel Schmalstieg 12:49 pm on February 5, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      For international users, improving the handling of accents/diacritics in file attachments would be a big win: https://core.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/22363 – the ticket has patches, and @markoheijnen has proposed it for 3.9 …

    • Tom Auger 7:59 pm on February 5, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      I’d like to discuss https://core.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/21811 and see if my patch / suggestions are salvageable, given the much bigger development effort around the entire Media Modal. The feature I was working on (prior to the whole Media Modal overhaul) was a very small, targeted, incremental enhancement that was kinda “shoehorned” in under that trac ticket, but really addresses something different and much smaller in scope.

    • Tom Auger 8:37 pm on February 5, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Update: I see @gcorne has done some great work demonstrating how this could get integrated into Media Modal. I’ll continue this week and see if I can bring these things together. As for today’s meeting – we just got massively dumped on in Toronto, so I’ma head out of the office now and may not get back online in time to catch this week’s meeting.

  • Andrew Nacin 12:13 pm on January 29, 2014 Permalink
    Tags: , agenda   

    Please propose agenda items for the development meeting today at 21:00 UTC. Let’s try to keep it to under an hour, like last week’s.

    Some to start us off:

    • Consider the Widgets Customizer plugin for 3.9 merge. If you haven’t looked at it yet, please spend some time today before the meeting. Obviously, we all like the idea, but we need to study the implementation and provide feedback. Please comment on that post if you haven’t already.
    • I’d like to propose an initiative for cleaning up a group of 556 tickets during the 3.9 cycle. (It has details, will explain in the meeting.)
    • Quick situation reports for various 3.9 tasks. If you’re working on something, please come armed with a sentence so we can do these rapid-fire — or post it in the comments thread. Some things are moving forward quickly, some aren’t. Where can we help? Here’s a list of what was proposed for 3.9 (see also the comments, which were updated after the last meeting). We need to take the “proposed” label off soon…
    • I’d like to get moving on the Trac component re-organization; I’ll see if there are any questions. We will need some help to move around tickets (ideally adding feedback to them along the way), so I’ll be looking for volunteers and talking about what is needed.

    Aren’t familiar with how these meetings work? They’re especially good for breaking logjams — whether that means talking through a major sticking point, finding volunteers to help with something. We also use them to plan out schedules and tasks, make sure everyone is on the same page, and do release post-mortems to see how things went. (As 3.8.1 was released on Thursday, could be good to discuss this and 3.8.2, for example.)

    The meeting takes place in IRC on chat.freenode.net in the #wordpress-dev channel. See you then!

     
    • William Bowles 12:27 pm on January 29, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      I like it! One of the problems with WP has always been the amount of time spent moving between the various components that make up the site. I’d like to see a lot of the backend stuff move to the Customize sidebar and the popout access to other widget tools seems to work perfectly.

    • Tom Auger 2:06 pm on January 29, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      I have moved forward with https://core.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/21811. Still trying the time to upload an actual patch, but could use some eyes on the last two plugin ZIPs that were uploaded to see whether there’s any buy-in on my proof-of-concept approach to modularizing the Image Editor.

    • Tom Lynch 2:43 pm on January 29, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      I’d suggest considering talk around some of the older parts of wp-admin that have static coded HTML tables that don’t have any hooks or filters, nor use the Settings API to actually make it possible for people to develop management plugins.

    • John Blackbourn 3:11 pm on January 29, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      We should have a think about how we can start to build this new “easy first bug” report on Trac.

    • Jen Mylo 3:28 pm on January 29, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      GSoC 2014. I’ll post about it on this blog before the meeting, but would like to take a few minutes during the chat to discuss areas of interest for projects and people who’d be interested in mentoring/co-mentoring so I can get the application started.

    • Andrew Ozz 4:16 pm on January 29, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Decide on JavaScript actions and filters, https://core.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/21170. We need JS hooks in core, either our own implementation or standardize on jQuery( document ).trigger( 'event-name' ). I know @koop had more thoughts on this but he hasn’t been around for a while.

    • tomdryan 4:17 pm on January 29, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      I may not be able to make it today, but I would like to propose creating a new task force that can look at existing plugins that would be good candidates to get moved into core. Most of the core efforts appear to be in developing new functionality, which is critical, but there are existing plugins that also fix gaps in the core feature set. The goal would be to identify those plugins and approach the authors to see what there interest level is in contributing their code to core. This approach unitizes WP excellent plug in architecture and plug in community to move WP core forward more rapidly.

      I love to hear comments about this idea (post here). I’ll try to make it to today’s meeting, but if not, I love to talk about this subject in the near future.

    • Bryan Petty 6:07 pm on January 29, 2014 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      I have an upstream update to PHPMailer in #25560. There are a couple decisions that still need to be made: include the full library, or strip it down without docs, tests, and examples (both patches are there), and a quick review of the approach on back-compat. This does need to in early in the cycle though, so about now is a good time, and hence why I bring it up now.

  • Andrew Nacin 8:25 pm on December 18, 2013 Permalink
    Tags: agenda   

    Proposed agenda for today’s dev chat (~35 minutes from now):

    • Initial debrief for 3.8. Start to think about what we can learn from 3.8.
    • Status report of bugs/regressions for 3.8.1. Look at a tentative 3.8.1 timeline.
    • Initial 3.9 discussion. Discuss potential feature plugin candidates, timeline, and release leads.
     
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